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Would reverse NACA ducts on the hood help out any?

Whups, sorry, forgot which issue you were trying to deal with. Best I can say then is go read the aero sub-forum on HBZ and see if there is anything useful there. Though I *think* I remember reading that the rad blockoff helps a little, and is even better with a belly pan.

Congrats!

Someone used tampon sport max

New stuff. Nothing reeeealy exciting, except for me. Now all the power should (in theory) make it to the wheels.

Fidanza 280zxt flywheel and 280zxt 240mm clutch from RPS. Guess I already posted the clutch image but here it is again for effect. I had removed my transmission (finally) last week only to find that the clutch would not fit my stock flywheel. Kind of a DUR moment, as I should have known the stock flywheel was for a 280z and only had a 225mm friction surface. Decided it would be stupid to just buy another stock model so I layed the green down for a Fidanza. Looks like it'll fit nicely. What amazes me most is now the clutch weighs more than my flywheel!

I'm a bit worried how the rest of the engine will fare. I still have trouble cold starting it, and I'm afraid that less rotational mass will reduce the momentum to a degree that will make it even harder. Also seriously considering a better harmonic damper for the front of the crank to even things out. Hopefully the $90 model from MSA will do.

Still in the mail are another mess of small parts and a few goodies. My clutch line is heavily dry rotted and I'm amazed it lasted this long. So I got a steel braided one. Will also be replacing the master and slave cylinders with this install as I'm anticipating the clutch being a bit heavier.


The transmission is one filthy whore, and I can say with as much trouble as I had removing it I'm dreading putting it back in. Next time, I'll use a floor jack. Of course, I'll be cleaning and painting it before that happens.

Well, in theory less rotational mass will be easier for the starter to crank, but once it fires it will be up to the momentum of the engine to get it going.

I see where you are heading with this, but its not that dramatic of a weight difference on the rotating mass. The harmonic balencer is there for a reason.

Yes, and less momentum may mean the engine can't self sustain during a cold start.

Not sure exactly what you're trying to say here, but the harmonic balancer that I have now is just the stock piece of crap which does little more than drive a few belts. I'm not just getting a REAL damper to even out the flywheel, its also just a good idea. Reducing crankshaft vibrations is always good, especially now that the engine will be revving quicker.

if it can't self sustain, then it's just up to you to have a fast-idle while cold tune.


edit: some's got a Q for you on HBZ: http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php?/topic...re-they-custom/

This post has been edited by PanzerAce on Mar 2 2010, 02:24 PM

Thanks a bunch, dude. I actually responded to that guy a while ago but I guess I didn't use the right channel. HBZ's new layout threw me for a loop.

I would tune the car if I could, but the Haltech ECU won't interface with any computer I've hooked up to it so far. It tries to connect, gets to about 50%, then restarts. Luckily, the ECU was already tuned to the engine when I got it, and since I've only done relatively minor modifications it still runs awesome in all other aspects.

I'd say you need to figure that issue out No good having a stand-alone you can't tune.

Hmmm, that's wierd that it won't connect. Guess you're kinda in the same boat with cold starts that I am then: stay in the car with your foot on the gas to keep it running

Actually, come to think of it, in a month or two my Z's going to be a lot more similar to yours than it is. Going for a EFI/5spd/turbo swap after I get a couple of paychecks from my new job. Any recomendations for a turbo to push ~10psi on a L30?

Stock turbo is fine for that kind of boost, however it will fall flat on its face at about 4500-5000rpm. With a T3/T04E you could make a "longer lasting" 10lbs, and it would push more air at the same time making more power. Much more efficient, probably the best match for the engine. Its still a journal bearing turbo so its easy to rebuild, but then again I might just be ignorant and not know that ball bearing turbos are just as easy. I assume they're not. Or you can go the Big Phil route and get a GT35R, ball bearing turbo similar to the T3/T04E I mentioned.


But you knew all this already, didn't you?


[ Post merged on Mar 3 2010, 05:26 AM ]

Yes, I do. Its been pissing me off ever since I first tried to start the car after the swap.

I had a nice MSD 6A hooked up instead of the stock 280zxt spark controller which was wired into the Haltech harness. It wouldn't throw a spark because a setting needed to be changed. Couldn't find a laptop old enough to have the serial port required so I had to find a serial-to-usb adapter. Also didn't have a windows 95/98 disc, which the Haltech software was supposed to run on. So I went on the Haltech website and found a fix for running it on XP. Even their solution won't work. I tried every version of the software, all updates. Best result I had was it loading to 50% then konking out. Very frustrating.

A little while ago I even considered buying a whole new E6X ECU (since it has the same pin connections), getting a base map for the engine and starting from scratch. And at least that ECU is new and meant to run on windows (E6K software is DOS based). Nope. Pin connections may be the same, but they are in a completely different order so I'd still have to make/buy a new harness. f**k.

I'll figure it out eventually. Right now I'm trying to find an old ass laptop with a serial port and windows 95/98. If that doesn't work then I'll know its the ECU that's bad. But for now at least it runs the current setup, and does it well.


[ Post merged on Mar 3 2010, 02:14 PM ]
Update: Old ass laptop found. Fingers crossed.

Also, keep in mind that all Serial-To-USB adapters are not created equally. There are many different chipsets, and not all of them will work with specific applications such as car interfaces. I know, since I tried more than one back when I was working with guys reverse-engineering the ECU and TCU on the Subaru SVX. I had a Belkin adapter laying around designed for Palm Pilots that simply would not work. I then got an adapter from a local Fry's Electronics for about $3 that worked like a charm.

The easiest way would be if Haltech (or anyone experienced with their ECUs) lists a "check code" for the computer. Meaning you open a serial communication manually, send a code, and the ECU sends a response. Basically, just checking to make sure the connection works. That's how we tested the SVX.

Anyway, best of luck with that old laptop. I think I still have my serial-USB adapter around from when I worked with the SVX if you want to try it.

Actually odd man, I didn't know most of that, I've been trying my damndest to stay away from EFI and turbo reading untill I needed to do it

Def not going to go for a GT35R, no need for that much turbo at this point, since this swap is only going to be an incremental step before next years M104 turbo build.

Lol, sorry for assuming. Yeah, I'd say go with a stock 280zx turbo. Its a good amount of starting power to play with as you learn. Mine is still going off the stock internal wastegate, but I have a mechanical boost controller plumbed in for ~13lbs. Easy to rebuild too. With 1/4 of a soda bottle more displacement in your engine I can't see the performance being terribly different from mine. Should work just fine.


[ Post merged on Mar 3 2010, 04:15 PM ]
@ Nomake Wan

Yeah, I had dreaded that too. My USB-serial isn't big enough to have any sort of chipset, its literally just a USB on one end and a serial on the other. I believe it was a Belkin. I am disappoint. It should have been working to a degree though, as when we tried the earliest version of the software the ECU bounced back a "f**k you, use a newer software version" message. Some of the data along the line of it interfacing past 50% muct have just not translated well in the adapter, or maybe XP just didn't like it and threw a wrench in the works. So far its still a mystery, a somewhat expensive mystery, since I just bought an old Toughbook for $75...

well, since I'm getting a shop to do it, I'll probably be talking with them about it a fair bit as well. I'd do all the swapping myself, but I'm going to be moving from the "Have the time/space, but no money" to "Have money, but no time/space", so it's just going to be better in the long run to drop it off somewhere, and come back in a week or two to pick it up.

LOL. If it converts USB to Serial, it has a chipset. Crack open the USB end, that's where it's located. If it was a Belkin, then there you go... they're not good for car stuff. Belkin does a lot of proprietary shit with their adapters which is why I hate them. I'm still willing to send you my adapter, I found it just now in my room so yeah, I've still got it. Cost of shipping.

Heh, well I guess I was wrong. I don't know much about them so I assumed that it was too tiny to have a chipset, like some of the other ones that were bulkier. Its ok, you don't have to send anything. I have an old toughbook laptop on the way, and it comes loaded with features such as serial ports, 32MB RAM, floppy drive, 150mHz processor, 2GB hard drive and Windows 98. This machine is too leet for USB.

If it's too bulky for you, hit me up anytime. With luck though, it'll work just fine. I'll be rootin' for ya!

I'm a bit furious. The transmission fill plug still refuses to come out. This is the second time I've battled with it, with no success. The previous owner rounded the hell out of it, but I don't blame him because making the grasping point a huge f**king 1/2" square is the stupidest idea ever. Last time I just removed the backup light switch and filled it from there. This time, I want everything done right so that little bastard is coming out. Blasting it with a propane torch and freezing it have no effect. Drain plug still comes out fine, because unlike its counterpart its made so you can just pop in a 1/2" drive breaker bar/wrench/anything. I think tomorrow I might just swallow my pride and take it to goddamn jiffy lube and let them have a go. The autozone here also doesn't carry Redline MT-90 which further pisses me off.

Similar story with the flywheel. Pressing in the alignment dowels with my vice (as stated in the instructions) isn't working at all. Some guy on HBZ said he just lightly tapped them in with a hammer. I'd like to know what kind of magic he wields. Hammer or vice, they won't go in mine, and they certainly won't go straight either. Dowels are in the freezer now for the night, I might even cook the flywheel in the oven for a few minutes to see if that will work.

Spending all this money lately is depressing.

Once in a while though, I buy something ridiculous and shiny for the car where money could have better been spent on something more useful. Today's arrival was no exception.


Bottom right is the useful stuff. Long needed fuel pump blockoff (the 280zxt version had a huge power steering pump mount that pressed against my intercooler piping), the stainless clutch line and an oil dipstick (out of picture) that now has a much better seal. But the top right is my favorite, the Fairlady Z emblem. I've been resisting it for a long time now, and the other day I finally gave in and added it to the cart. Its even better than I imagined. I was expecting a plastic thing like the similar "Datsun" one my car came with. No. This one is metal, and perfectly painted.

I'd add in a "432" emblem which would complete the look of the car, but that would be just wrong. That should only go on the Z that carried the S20 engine. Now I know some of you may be saying "Well by your logic a FairladyZ emblem shouldn't be on your car either, cause its not RHD, hypocrite!" Sue me. You can put me in the same category as those tools who put Altezza labels on their IS300s. After putting so much into this car and altering its appearance to a more japanesy tone, I can't see it as a Datsun 280z anymore. To me it is a FairladyZ. And that emblem will be on my BRE spoiler where it belongs, until some bastard pries it off with a pocket knife and steals it.

This post has been edited by Oddmanout84 on Mar 3 2010, 11:07 PM

I would tell you to torch the fill plug but you already did that. Jiffy Lube will not touch it, I worked there for a while and if they couldnt break it loose with-out stripping it or if its already stripped they refuse to service the car. I guess its to avoid lawsuits.

I love the FairladyZ emblem, it looks great too.

All cars require more moneys, especailly turbo cars and older Japanese cars. (Shizz, my car is almost 20 years old, but thats nothing on yours)

Got the plug out today at a local transmission shop. We torched it, pipe wrenched it and put candle wax down the threads. Finally we removed it with a big breaker bar while simultaneously hitting it with an air hammer. Those guys were great, and they didn't even charge me for it. I'll have to drop off a case of beer or something for them some time. New plugs ordered from Nissan, should be here Saturday.


[ Post merged on Mar 4 2010, 04:42 PM ]


The pilot bushing I just pulled is on the right... It was visibly pretty far gone even before I popped it out with the grease/socket method.

So I finally got it finished. The new flywheel is in along with the new clutch. Torqued all bolts to spec and safety wired the flywheel bolts together. After having issues with the new clutch master cylinder, I swapped the pushrod from my stock one into it and it seems to disengage just fine. Fixed a few things in the interior with the carpet, relocated the Haltech computer, put header wrap on the downpipe. By around 11 pm I had everything in and double checked, and the car on the ground. Started the car as normal, with me pumping the gas pedal slightly to get her going. Took a little longer than usual, but then it fired up. Ran VERY rough. Held the pedal to sustain idle speed until the car warmed a bit more, about half a minute. The engine is still running very rough, with a loud knocking sound. The whole motor shakes with each knock, normally when running you can't see it move at all. I can't pinpoint it in the engine by ear or using my stethoscope. Killed the engine, checked all the plugs. All are wet except #2. That plug has always been mysteriously clean compared to the others, but never caused the engine to make a knock. All plugs are firing, same with injectors. My AFR gauge is strangely not lit.

Shut the car off for a minute thinking maybe the Haltech ECU plug isn't seated right. Went upstairs to make a quick printout of the wiring harness so I can check the pin functions on the plug by number. In the meantime I'm panicking, trying to figure out what I could have possibly done wrong. The pictures I took clearly show that I put the friction disc on correctly. Replacing the pilot bushing was particularly tricky, the grease method didn't work so I had to use wet paper. The old bushing shattered as it came out, the new one went in without a fuss. This time when I put the tranny back in I had a floor jack to assist me but it was still a pain to line up and get my pilot shaft in the hole (har har). Used the rope method to lock up the motor when I torqued everything, but I made sure #1 was on the compression stroke before I put the rope in. Don't think I bent a valve...

Came back downstairs after about 10 minutes. Unplugged the ECU, made sure the pins were aligned correctly, then plugged it back in. Started the car. It fired up, and the knocking was about gone. Very weird. Revved it, observed it for a few minutes, nothing but noisy injectors as usual. The AFR gauge is actually reading something now, slightly lean, normal for idle. I had to cancel further testing to avoid waking neighbors. By then it was 1 am. I'll have to get back to it tomorrow and test it further.

Needless to say, I'm still a bit nervous. Bad gas? The car has only sat for a few weeks at most, can't imagine it would go bad in the lines that quick. This is all very odd.

I want to clear some thing ups, 10 pounds is 10 pounds. There no "high floh!" 10 pounds and "Loh floh !" 10 pounds. My experience? Ive helped operate 3 dynos over the past 2 years, so take my input with a grain of salt.

This is one of the most useful tidbits of information I can think of when it comes to "judging" a turbo motor. Motors are nothing but air pumps. Take an NA motor, give it wot, and hopefully with a good intake, itll be running 1 bar of air, one atmosphere, 14.7 psi (at sea level). Anything beyond this and we measure boost. Conservative tuning and heat soak aside, the following is a DAMN good rule of thumb. Take an na motor, ANY na motor, add one bar of boost (running 14.7 psi of boost through it) and youve doubled the air going through the motor, you will double the power. 14.7 psi of boost is 14.7 psi of boost is 14.7 psi of boost. If you have the pressure of the air going into the motor, you know how much air is going into the motor. Theres no "high flow" psi, theres no "low flow" pounds of boost. Think of it this way, if this WAS true, running a car with a map sensor would be useless- it just measures pressure, how would it know how much "floh" is actually going into the motor? Making sense here still?

If x turbo makes more power @ 10 psi than y turbo @ 10 psi, there are other factors- not the amount of flow going into the engine. Be it a better exhaust design, or its ability to actually MAKE 10 psi at a more benefitial rpm (Ie down low by spooling faster, or continueing to MAKE 10 psi in the upper rpms).

All this tech nonsense aside Im curious oddman, where did you get your stainless clutch line from? The one on my car is in a sad state and id love to snag one up myself too but havnet found where yet.

I'm still have to disagree with that a bit, but I see what you're saying. A soda bottle with air in it at 10psi is going to have the same density as a large propane tank at the same pressure, even though their volumes are the different. But say you've got a GT12 and a GT60, running side by side, trying to push 10lbs of boost into an engine. Lets forget for a second that their inertia is going to be different and take turbo lag out of the equation. Sure, they can both be pushing 10lbs, but how efficiently? Obviously, the GT60 is going to build up 10psi first.

Lets take the engine out of the equation and instead say that both turbos are feeding pressure from their compressors into two separate giant balloons. The balloons are the same size. Which balloon is going to fill up first?

I'm using extreme examples here to make a point. You can't tell me that a GT12 pushing 10psi through an L28 is going to be the same as a GT60 (or more realistically, a T3/TO4E). The GT12 would be running incredibly hot, operating waaaay out of its efficiency range, and probably going through compressor stall. The T3/T04e however would be operating within its efficiency range, easily able to keep up with supply and demand to the engine. Make sense?

I'm not saying the PRESSURE is different, 10lbs IS 10lbs. But how the turbocharger operates and is able to push this amount of air through an engine efficiently, THAT'S why its different. That's why 10lbs from a small turbo is not the same as 10lbs from a large one. And that was the point I was trying to make in that kid's thread. PSI that you push into an engine through the turbo is only a small part of a larger equation when it comes to matching a turbo to an engine. Otherwise, we'd all be running tiny turbos that spool instantly to 20psi and hold it all the way to 10,000rpm while staying cool.

Aside from that, the stainless braided clutch line was bought from Motorsport auto, thezstore.com. It works really well, fits great. at like $20, its not too bad either. I suppose if you got the exact measurements though, you could order it directly from Earls, that's who actually makes it.

This post has been edited by Oddmanout84 on Mar 14 2010, 02:09 PM